Explanations/etymology also appreciated!

For Joe Shmoe, it means a very average or below average person. It’s a derivation of the practice of using “shm-” to dismiss something (eg “Practice shmactice. We’re already perfect”).

And “John Smith” is meant to be the most average name or person imaginable, so they have the “most common” (citation needed) first and last name as well.

  • Hubi@feddit.de
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    95
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    In Germany there is “Max Mustermann”, which basically translates to Max Template-man. It’s the default German name used for templates of official documents like passports and such.

    • ValiantDust@feddit.de
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      15
      ·
      1 year ago

      Don’t forget his wife, Erika Mustermann, geb. (née) Gabler. She’s usually the one used for passports these days. I think there’s a whole Mustermann family living in these templates.

    • Tschuuuls@feddit.de
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      15
      ·
      1 year ago

      In German there are also derogatory uses for the forenames “Kevin” and “Otto” for example. Often used to depict not well educated persons that have made extremely stupid decisions/choices.

      • ndguardian@lemmy.studio
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        14
        ·
        1 year ago

        As someone with a brother named Kevin, I can confirm he’s doing his part to uphold that depiction.

      • dreadgoat@kbin.social
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        9
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        I think this one is pretty confined to my region (southwestern USA) but we use Otto as the moniker of a generic stupid person too, but probably for a different reason: Otto is Oblivious to the Obvious

  • vis4valentine@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    61
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    In my country (Spanish speaking) we say “Fulano de tal” Fulano is kinda like a template name nobody really is named like that. “De tal” really means something like “from somewhere”.

    We dont out it on the graves, but we use it as slang for situations where we need to refer to someone generic like “imagine a fulano de tal doing xxxxxxxxxxx”.

    There are other names like Zutano, Mengano, etc.

    Edit: My mom sometimes uses “Miguel Perez”. Those 2 are very common first and last names.

    • Beto@lemmy.studio
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      25
      ·
      1 year ago

      In Brazil (Portuguese speaking) we also use Fulano de tal. I didn’t know it was used in other countries!

      We also “José Ninguém” and “Maria Ninguém” to mean someone who’s a nobody. It literally means Joseph/Mary (very common names in Brazil) Nobody.

      • lalo@discuss.tchncs.de
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        1 year ago

        There’s also a name that expresses the same feeling of ‘Joe Schmoe’ in pt-br: ‘Zé Roela’

        And to expand on Fulano’s family, we must not forget Beltrano and Ciclano.

    • babi99@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      20
      ·
      1 year ago

      Does this came from arabic influence?

      To refer someone without a name or generic name we sometime say Fulan bin Fulan meaning someone the son of someone

      • driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        11
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        A lot of Spanish words and culture come from Arabic influences, the iberic peninsula was under control of arabs on the VIII century.

      • jsveiga@sh.itjust.works
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        5
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Just checked in a Brazilian Portuguese real made from trees dictionary, indeed comes from arabic (indicated by the “ár fulân”)

  • fubo@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    47
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    In US legal cases, “John Doe”, “Jane Roe”, and similar names are used for pseudonymized legal parties.

    For instance, the plaintiff in the famous abortion case Roe v. Wade was one Norma McCorvey, identified as “Jane Roe”.

    A group of unidentified people appearing as plaintiffs or defendants may be called a group of “Does”, from the name John Doe.

    The words doe and roe both refer to deer, which are common wild animals in North America — and as wild animals, represent an arbitrary unspecified person. A doe is a female deer; and while “roe” can also mean fish eggs, roe deer is a common European species of deer.

  • drkt@feddit.dk
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    36
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Denmark -

    Brian <- A name, but also a slur for people considered ‘hillbilly’. Very frequently used against people who drive cheap tuner hatchbacks. Said cars can be referred to as Brian Cars.

    Peter Jensen <- Also a name, but it’s become notorious in Jutland because it feels like everyone is immediately related to someone with this exact first and last name.

    • nparkinglot@lemmy.dbzer0.com
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      15
      ·
      1 year ago

      I can’t tell you how much I love that Denmark has hillbillys who drive hatchbacks and are called fuckin’ Brian as a slur.

    • WaterBottleOnAShelf@lemmy.nz
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      7
      ·
      1 year ago

      Interesting. In the UK (at least when I was growing up, I haven’t lived there for some time) we called doing up shit cars as Barry-ing them. I know in other parts of the country they used the name Ned or Kev to refer to the people that drove those cars.

    • MartinXYZ@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      I think more generally people use " hr. og fru Jensen" for a more exact analog of “John/Jane Smith”

      But Peter Jensen was the most common name in Denmark for many years, so you’re not completely wrong.

    • avalokitesha@discuss.tchncs.de
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      12
      ·
      1 year ago

      That’s the official version, but at least when I talk about some average dude it’s way too long and artificial, I don’t think the name Mustermann actually exists.

      When I think of the most common name to use in casual conversation, I’d probably go for Müller (maybe Peter? Though the first name is probably heavily generation-dependent).

      In older publication you may alse find references to “der deutsche Michel” (the german Michel, short for Michael) as a somewhat condescending reference to the average citizen who is very hesitant to adopt new concepts and tech and not always able or willing to understand complex concepts. Often used to remark that a product/idea will not have a chance on the market because “der deutsche Michel” doesn’t see the pointor would never pick it up.

      Haven’t seen that in a while though, I guess Germans have become more open to new stuff :)

  • Grimlo9ic@kbin.social
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    23
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    In the Philippines, it’s Juan and Maria dela Cruz, although those have fallen out of use due to the popularity of Western (aka US) culture. Interesting reading about every country’s own names for their everyman.

  • wildeaboutoskar@beehaw.org
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    23
    ·
    1 year ago

    We have the phrase ‘every Tom, Dick and Harry’ which is like that (UK)

    If we’re talking about a generic person it’s usually Mr/s Smith or Mr/s Jones (near Wales)

  • Fenzik@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    22
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    In the Netherlands there’s “Jan Modaal”, modaal (modal) referring the most commonly occurring value in or peak of a distribution. This name is used often when representing the experience of the most average Dutchman.

    It’s especially often used in financial discussions and journalism, like “owning a house is getting further out of reach for Jan Modaal.”

  • thebestaquaman@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    21
    ·
    1 year ago

    In Norway we have the stereotypical Norwegians “Ola Nordmann” and “Kari Nordmann”. Ola and Kari were quite common names a couple generations ago (not so common now). “Nordmann” literally translates to “Norwegian [person]”, but is also a not-too-uncommon last name.

    We typically talk about them if we’re describing something or some situation and what the stereotypical Norwegian would do/think.

    • lemmy@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      7
      ·
      1 year ago

      “Nordmann” is also a german word. It means “Norseman/Northman” or “Man from the north”.

  • Green_Bay_Guy@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    18
    ·
    1 year ago

    In Vietnam, I think it’s just most names 😂. Anh Nguyen is probably a good example. Most Vietnamese have the last name Nguyen. The national naming conventions rival that of religious families in the west. Think, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. Anh, An, Thanh, and Minh. Women are the same, but named after things considered beautiful, Tuyet, Hong, Pham, Van.

    Funny enough, many names aren’t always gendered, so I’ve met a decent amount of couples with the same first and last names. An Thi Nguyen, and An Van Nguyen is a couple that comes to mind. I dont have to worry about doxxing, since I bet that exists over 1000x here.

  • FourPacketsOfPeanuts@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    17
    ·
    1 year ago

    Some others in the Anglosphere:

    Fred Bloggs - no idea where it’s from. Related to “bog” as in bog standard maybe?

    Tom, Dick and Harry - is ages old. Even as far back as Shakespeare you can see the triplet evolving. “Tom, Dicke, and Francis” : Henry IV, Part I

  • alf@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    16
    ·
    1 year ago

    In Norway we have “Ola Nordmann” and “Kari Nordmann”. Ola and Kari are pretty common and generic names. Nordmann literally means Norwegian, but can also be used as a last name.

  • Thorny_Thicket@sopuli.xyz
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    16
    ·
    1 year ago

    In Finnish it’s Matti Meikäläinen for male and Maija Meikäläinen for woman. Matti Meikäläinen roughly translates to Matt Myself

    • gerdesj@lemmy.ml
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      So that might be Matty and Miya Meiikaalayinen. Dealing with diacritics from a language that has none is a bit tricky.

      Am I even close?